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  1. #1
    Senior Member tiffany's Avatar
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    Question calcium and dkh qns

    Qn 1 - At level of dkh will the alk affect the calcium levels. and what level of calcium are we concerning ourselves with in the answer?

    Qn 2 - I have been told that adding a calc supp, that only affects the calc, will impose an ionic imbalance in the tank, so what then if the only para out is the calc? If I use Kalk instead, and the ph and alk are fine, then the ph and alk may subsequently be too high and disproportionate to the calc, which will lead to a drop in the calc. Which leads me back to the original problem of raising the calc only, without inducing an ionic imbalance. (There have been rather stern and opinionated views on this one, so I thought I'd bring it here, for a balanced answer)

    Thanks for your thoughts.
    (hard hobby when when it's so supposition and opinion based)
    "The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."
    - Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

  2. #2
    ATC
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    I think that if you slowly drip kalk overnight (i.e. when pH naturally drops) it will maintain your pH at a more constant value while increasing your calc. I don't think that it affects alk. Tang man posted a really good article on calc-alk-pH problems and how to solve them. There are a couple of additonal links within that document to further explain the whole calc-alk thing.

    Myself, I use turbo calcium in my new water to bring up calc and add kalk to the tank (when needed) to help maintain the levels. Hope this helps.
    Aven

  3. #3
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    Good questions. You need a balanced alk & Ca to prevent a snowstorm (or precipatation). If you continually add CaCl2 (a calcium supplement) you will have an ion imbalance because of the chemical makeup of the supplement. A few additions of a Ca or alk supplement to balance the Ca & alk will not cause an inbalance. Here are some articles to explain this further.

    http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/nov2002/chem.htm
    This article explains what to do when the Ca or alk is out of the desired area.

    I use this calculator to know how much I need to add to bring the Ca & alk back in balance - http://www.kademani.com/reefchem.htm

    Here's a good article on supplements - http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/feb2003/chem.htm

    Here is another article on calcium in the water - http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/mar2002/chem.htm

    Now to find Randy's article on ion inbalance - Unfortunately, I can't find the artile on ion inbalance right now. I have to leave but maybe one of the articles above will help explain it.

    Vickie

  4. #4
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    Aven - Kalk is a balanced supplement (has both calcium & alk) that is used to maintain your calcium and alk. It is usually not used to increase either calcium or alk (since it contains both) but can over time gradually increase the level of both in your tank. Usually you use a higher concentration (like a 2 part supplement) if you wish to bring your levels up quickly.

    Vickie

  5. #5
    Senior Member tiffany's Avatar
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    To maintain levels wouldn't kalk have to have an increasing affect on those para's? As it would increase the levels to maintain the balance as they dropped, and it's know to increase PH if added too quickly.
    Kalk is generally good if all the parameters are ok. What if one's out??
    And if it's not used to increase the calc, then what do you use without causing an ionic imbalance?
    Thanks for the articles, I have reading tonight, I'm not a screen reader so I print the good ones off....I'll do a search for that article mentioned, but I have to be up early so I'll look again tomorrow.
    "The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."
    - Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

  6. #6
    Senior Member Conan's Avatar
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    Originally posted by ATC
    I think that if you slowly drip kalk overnight (i.e. when pH naturally drops) it will maintain your pH at a more constant value while increasing your calc. I don't think that it affects alk. Tang man posted a really good article on calc-alk-pH problems and how to solve them. There are a couple of additonal links within that document to further explain the whole calc-alk thing.
    Is there a way to know what article this is?
    Thanks
    Do or do not. There is no "try" - Jedi Master Yoda

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  8. #8
    ATC
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    Aven

  9. #9
    Senior Member tiffany's Avatar
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    From the article I read on choosing supplements, the the main contention is:
    Use a balanced additive to prevent the ionic imbalance. ie: B-Ionic (which I'll have to order on-line) and only use these to assist in a dual deficit.
    If you plan/need to use only a single additive ie: alk buffer, then test, test, test the water to ensure the ongoing ionic balance - makes sense...
    He also mentions not to use an Alk buffer for PH as you need to fix the ph if that's the problem,(makes sense) but on the occasions that I find the ph on the low side ie: 8, then I know it's going to go down further to 7.8 ( I have waited to see what Will happen on several occasions and tested, tested,tested...) and I use Alk buffer to correct this as inevitably the Alk will suffer too, So in conclusion according to the article I should use the ph only buffer and test test test and then when the alk inevitably falls then add the alk buffer, and test, test, test ....... (and it's driving me silly doing it every second day, and then I check every thing else once a week too). So I use Kent's Supper Buffer dkh, for both as it wont increase the ph above 8.2, and I think that this alternative should have been entered into the arguments he put forth (IMHO) as Kent's (IME) does what it says.
    But I need to find the problem to falling Alk, using NSW with a reading of 7dkh there's not much room for error. (and a cheap alternative) I wa thinking magnesium which has been on mind for a while, even when I was using ASW, but if I have the same problem with NSW and ASW then that negates that argument. Overfeeding may be worth considering, as I do feed 2* day and 3'4 block frozen for 4 fish, but, ALL the food is eaten....Any ideas?
    also my calc drops to 375 from about 400-425, and I only have a few shrooms, I have put this down to coraline algae growth that thickly covers every square inch of rock......the Alk is never let to go so high or low to affect the calc.

    Another question, I am aware that it's best to use Kalk at night due to the ph fluctuations, but it would seem logical that the increase will be carried on into the day as well. Please correct me if I'm wrong and explain why....

    I think I have RSI from this post.....It'a a good thing Law and verbosity go well together.....hyeah: :wink5:
    "The significant problems we face cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them."
    - Albert Einstein (1879-1955)

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